[{"data":1,"prerenderedAt":-1},["ShallowReactive",2],{"footer-top-topics-es":3,"footer-top-speakers-es":65,"transcript-39881161-1e7a-4856-8531-023b1c214e6a-es":172,"transcript-poster-39881161-1e7a-4856-8531-023b1c214e6a":2351},{"limit":4,"offset":5,"topics":6,"total":64},10,0,[7,13,19,25,31,36,41,47,53,58],{"label":8,"n_speakers":9,"n_utterances":10,"n_videos":11,"slug":12},"Seguridad Nacional",26,2695,190,"seguranca-nacional",{"label":14,"n_speakers":15,"n_utterances":16,"n_videos":17,"slug":18},"Educación",32,1685,229,"educacao",{"label":20,"n_speakers":21,"n_utterances":22,"n_videos":23,"slug":24},"Seguridad pública y orden",23,1580,244,"seguranca-publica-e-ordem",{"label":26,"n_speakers":27,"n_utterances":28,"n_videos":29,"slug":30},"Combate a la Impunidad",33,1469,292,"combate-a-impunidade",{"label":32,"n_speakers":15,"n_utterances":33,"n_videos":34,"slug":35},"Política monetaria",1448,303,"politica-monetaria",{"label":37,"n_speakers":21,"n_utterances":38,"n_videos":39,"slug":40},"Poder judicial",846,149,"poder-judiciario",{"label":42,"n_speakers":43,"n_utterances":44,"n_videos":45,"slug":46},"Servicio Público",28,788,178,"servico-publico",{"label":48,"n_speakers":49,"n_utterances":50,"n_videos":51,"slug":52},"Salud Pública \u002F Seguridad Pública",25,756,139,"saude-publica-seguranca-publica",{"label":54,"n_speakers":43,"n_utterances":55,"n_videos":56,"slug":57},"Política social",684,197,"politica-social",{"label":59,"n_speakers":60,"n_utterances":61,"n_videos":62,"slug":63},"Reforma fiscal",22,671,134,"reforma-fiscal",625,{"limit":4,"offset":5,"speakers":66,"total":171},[67,81,93,102,112,123,134,142,149,160],{"slug":68,"name":69,"party":70,"role":70,"state":70,"n_speeches":71,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":72,"photo_url":76,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":77,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":79},"renan-santos","Renan Santos","",22525,[73,74,75],"Abuso de Autoridad","Acciones afirmativas","Acción ejecutiva","\u002Fprofiles\u002Frenan-santos\u002Fphoto.png","Q51882553","none",{"twitter":80},"@RenanSantosMBL",{"slug":82,"name":83,"party":70,"role":70,"state":84,"n_speeches":85,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":86,"photo_url":89,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":90,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":91},"romeu-zema","Romeu Zema","MG",12888,[75,87,88],"Activismo político","Afiliación Partidaria","\u002Fprofiles\u002Fromeu-zema\u002Fphoto.png","Q57092113",{"twitter":92},"@RomeuZema",{"slug":94,"name":95,"party":70,"role":70,"state":70,"n_speeches":96,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":97,"bio_short":70,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":99},"pablo-marcal","Pablo Marçal",12772,[98,75,87],"Acción Humanitaria",{"twitter":100,"youtube":101},"@pablomarcal","https:\u002F\u002Fwww.youtube.com\u002F@pablomarcall",{"slug":103,"name":104,"party":70,"role":70,"state":105,"n_speeches":106,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":107,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":110,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":111},"fernando-haddad","Fernando Haddad","SP",12647,[88,108,109],"Agricultura y agronegocio","Alianzas políticas","Q3069485",{},{"slug":113,"name":114,"party":70,"role":70,"state":115,"n_speeches":116,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":117,"photo_url":119,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":120,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":121},"ronaldo-caiado","Ronaldo Caiado","GO",12538,[74,88,118],"Agenda Pública","\u002Fprofiles\u002Fronaldo-caiado\u002Fphoto.png","Q10364348",{"twitter":122},"@ronaldocaiado",{"slug":124,"name":125,"party":70,"role":126,"state":105,"n_speeches":127,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":128,"photo_url":130,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":131,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":132},"tarcisio","Tarcisio","Governador",11298,[129,88,118],"Actos Legislativos Locales","\u002Fprofiles\u002Ftarcisio\u002Fphoto.png","Q60392579",{"twitter":133},"tarcisiogdf",{"slug":135,"name":136,"party":70,"role":70,"state":70,"n_speeches":137,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":138,"photo_url":139,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":140,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":141},"luis-inacio-lula-da-silva","Luis Inacio Lula da Silva",10531,[87,88,108],"\u002Fprofiles\u002Fluis-inacio-lula-da-silva\u002Fphoto.png","Q37181",{},{"slug":143,"name":144,"party":70,"role":70,"state":70,"n_speeches":145,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":146,"bio_short":70,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":148},"augusto-cury","Augusto Cury",8912,[75,108,147],"Agro y desarrollo regional",{},{"slug":150,"name":151,"party":70,"role":70,"state":105,"n_speeches":152,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":153,"photo_url":156,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":157,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":158},"kim-kataguiri","Kim Kataguiri",8748,[154,75,155],"Abono Salarial","Activismo judicial","\u002Fprofiles\u002Fkim-kataguiri\u002Fphoto.png","Q21715169",{"twitter":159},"@KimKataguiri",{"slug":161,"name":162,"party":70,"role":70,"state":163,"n_speeches":164,"consistency_score":5,"top_topics":165,"photo_url":167,"bio_short":70,"wikidata_id":168,"mandate_status":78,"social_links":169},"flavio-bolsonaro","Flavio Bolsonaro","RJ",8066,[166,75,87],"Acción de oposición","\u002Fprofiles\u002Fflavio-bolsonaro\u002Fphoto.png","Q10283057",{"twitter":170},"@FlavioBolsonaro",37,{"falas":173,"lang":2339,"meta":2340},[174,180,187,194,201,207,212,218,224,231,237,242,248,254,260,265,271,277,282,288,294,300,306,311,316,322,327,332,338,343,349,355,361,366,372,379,385,390,395,401,407,413,419,425,431,436,442,448,454,460,466,472,478,484,490,496,502,509,515,521,527,533,539,545,551,557,563,569,574,580,585,591,597,603,609,615,621,627,633,639,645,651,657,663,669,675,681,687,693,699,705,711,717,723,729,735,741,747,753,759,765,771,777,783,789,795,801,807,813,819,824,830,836,842,848,854,860,866,872,878,884,890,896,902,908,914,920,926,932,938,944,950,956,962,968,973,979,985,991,997,1002,1008,1014,1020,1026,1032,1038,1044,1050,1056,1061,1067,1073,1079,1084,1090,1096,1102,1108,1114,1120,1126,1132,1138,1144,1150,1156,1162,1168,1174,1180,1186,1192,1198,1204,1210,1216,1222,1228,1233,1239,1245,1251,1257,1263,1269,1275,1280,1286,1292,1298,1303,1309,1315,1321,1327,1333,1339,1343,1349,1355,1361,1367,1373,1379,1385,1391,1397,1403,1409,1415,1421,1427,1432,1438,1444,1450,1456,1462,1468,1474,1480,1486,1492,1498,1504,1510,1516,1522,1528,1533,1539,1545,1551,1557,1563,1569,1575,1581,1587,1593,1599,1605,1611,1617,1622,1628,1634,1640,1646,1652,1658,1664,1670,1676,1682,1688,1694,1700,1706,1712,1718,1724,1730,1736,1742,1748,1754,1760,1766,1772,1778,1784,1790,1796,1802,1808,1814,1820,1826,1832,1838,1844,1850,1856,1862,1868,1874,1880,1886,1892,1898,1904,1909,1915,1921,1927,1933,1939,1945,1951,1956,1962,1968,1973,1979,1985,1991,1997,2003,2009,2015,2021,2027,2033,2039,2045,2051,2057,2063,2069,2075,2081,2087,2093,2099,2105,2111,2117,2123,2129,2135,2141,2147,2153,2159,2165,2171,2177,2183,2189,2195,2201,2207,2213,2219,2225,2231,2237,2243,2249,2255,2261,2267,2273,2279,2285,2291,2297,2303,2309,2315,2321,2327,2333],{"idx":5,"utterance_id":175,"speaker_name":176,"text":70,"start_s":177,"end_s":178,"word_count":5,"indexable":179},"72080","Desconhecido",11.02,11.16,false,{"idx":181,"utterance_id":182,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":183,"start_s":184,"end_s":185,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},1,"72081","Mi invitado de hoy es escritor, guionista y uno de los columnistas más leídos de la Folha de São Paulo.",9.54,15.9,19,{"idx":188,"utterance_id":189,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":190,"start_s":191,"end_s":192,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},2,"72082","No es un favor calificarlo como uno de los mejores textos de Brasil, al menos en mi modesta opinión.",16.66,23.24,17,{"idx":195,"utterance_id":196,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":197,"start_s":198,"end_s":199,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},3,"72083","Buenas noches, Antônio Prata.",23.68,25.02,4,{"idx":200,"utterance_id":202,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":203,"start_s":204,"end_s":205,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},"72084","¿Cómo estás?",25.12,25.58,5,{"idx":206,"utterance_id":208,"speaker_name":176,"text":209,"start_s":210,"end_s":211,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},"72085","Buenas noches, Haddad.",25.9,26.62,{"idx":213,"utterance_id":214,"speaker_name":176,"text":215,"start_s":216,"end_s":217,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},6,"72086","Gracias por la invitación.",26.72,27.76,{"idx":219,"utterance_id":220,"speaker_name":176,"text":221,"start_s":222,"end_s":223,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},7,"72087","Un placer estar aquí.",27.94,28.56,{"idx":225,"utterance_id":226,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":227,"start_s":228,"end_s":229,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},8,"72088","Un día me dijiste, Haddad, haz una ciclovía transatlántica hasta Uruguay.",29.58,36.68,14,{"idx":232,"utterance_id":233,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":234,"start_s":235,"end_s":236,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},9,"72089","Para que salvemos al menos a 500 mil personas.",37.64,40.16,{"idx":4,"utterance_id":238,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":239,"start_s":240,"end_s":241,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},"72090","Desde entonces, las cosas solo han mejorado.",42.62,44.6,{"idx":243,"utterance_id":244,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":245,"start_s":246,"end_s":247,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},11,"72091","Al menos como estábamos viendo el escenario.",45.82,49.14,{"idx":249,"utterance_id":250,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":251,"start_s":252,"end_s":253,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},12,"72092","¿Qué le pedirías a un alcalde que construyera?",50.08,53.24,{"idx":255,"utterance_id":256,"speaker_name":176,"text":257,"start_s":258,"end_s":259,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},13,"72093","¿Podrías llegar hasta dónde hoy?",53.3,54.46,{"idx":230,"utterance_id":261,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":262,"start_s":263,"end_s":264,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},"72094","¿Resuelve llegar hasta Uruguay?",55.04,57.08,{"idx":266,"utterance_id":267,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":268,"start_s":269,"end_s":270,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},15,"72095","¿Piensas que el mundo está todo complicado?",57.12,60.98,{"idx":272,"utterance_id":273,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":274,"start_s":275,"end_s":276,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},16,"72096","¿Cuál es tu percepción sobre el panorama global, específicamente sobre Brasil?",61.26,66.6,{"idx":193,"utterance_id":278,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":279,"start_s":280,"end_s":281,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},"72097","¿Cómo reacciona tu sensibilidad ante los acontecimientos más recientes?",67.1,72.56,{"idx":283,"utterance_id":284,"speaker_name":176,"text":285,"start_s":286,"end_s":287,"word_count":283,"indexable":179},18,"72098","Es difícil responder, ¿no, Haddad?, porque creo que nadie sabe muy bien en qué punto estamos.",73.62,80.7,{"idx":186,"utterance_id":289,"speaker_name":176,"text":290,"start_s":291,"end_s":292,"word_count":293,"indexable":179},"72099","Es difícil tratar de entender, pero es curioso que tú hables de esa columna, que creo que debe haber sido de 2015, 2016; hoy no haría esa columna porque en la época en que hablé de huir en bicicleta a Uruguay era una broma.",81.62,95.64,44,{"idx":295,"utterance_id":296,"speaker_name":176,"text":297,"start_s":298,"end_s":299,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},20,"72100","No tenía ninguna intención de salir del país en ese momento.",97.4,100.72,{"idx":301,"utterance_id":302,"speaker_name":176,"text":303,"start_s":304,"end_s":305,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},21,"72101","Y hoy en día me parece que eso ya no es una broma.",101.32,104.98,{"idx":60,"utterance_id":307,"speaker_name":176,"text":308,"start_s":309,"end_s":310,"word_count":301,"indexable":179},"72102","Podría ser necesario huir del país por causa de una persecución, por el riesgo de ser detenido, por el riesgo de ser asesinado.",105.8,113.5,{"idx":21,"utterance_id":312,"speaker_name":176,"text":313,"start_s":314,"end_s":315,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},"72103","Creo que ese fantasma autoritario está muy cerca.",115.18,119.1,{"idx":317,"utterance_id":318,"speaker_name":176,"text":319,"start_s":320,"end_s":321,"word_count":283,"indexable":179},24,"72104","Y es difícil escribir una crónica con ese... con ese oso gruñendo en la nuca, que es la realidad actual.",119.32,132.16,{"idx":49,"utterance_id":323,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":324,"start_s":325,"end_s":326,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},"72105","¿Cuánto crees que la comunicación más abierta, menos preocupada en, eventualmente, embellecer un poco la situación, contribuye a que lleguemos hasta aquí?",133.36,151.46,{"idx":9,"utterance_id":328,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":329,"start_s":330,"end_s":331,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},"72106","¿Crees que nos equivocamos en eso?",151.68,153.6,{"idx":333,"utterance_id":334,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":335,"start_s":336,"end_s":337,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},27,"72107","Habló menos... Street, ¿sabes?",155.1,157.32,{"idx":43,"utterance_id":339,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":340,"start_s":341,"end_s":342,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},"72108","Al menos directamente con la gente.",157.36,161.14,{"idx":344,"utterance_id":345,"speaker_name":176,"text":346,"start_s":347,"end_s":348,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},29,"72109","Usaste el término estrategia al principio.",161.72,163.94,{"idx":350,"utterance_id":351,"speaker_name":176,"text":352,"start_s":353,"end_s":354,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},30,"72110","No creo que haya una estrategia, porque no creo que la prensa brasileña quiera cubrir favorablemente a este gobierno.",163.98,169.74,{"idx":356,"utterance_id":357,"speaker_name":176,"text":358,"start_s":359,"end_s":360,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},31,"72111","Lejos de eso.",170.28,170.9,{"idx":15,"utterance_id":362,"speaker_name":176,"text":363,"start_s":364,"end_s":365,"word_count":43,"indexable":179},"72112","Creo que, en primer lugar, hay un cambio, en la realidad, muy rápido y muy complejo y que es muy difícil de entender y de cubrir como prensa.",172.96,186,{"idx":27,"utterance_id":367,"speaker_name":176,"text":368,"start_s":369,"end_s":370,"word_count":371,"indexable":179},"72113","Hablé mucho con la gente en la Folha durante las elecciones que era más importante cubrir los tweets de los hijos que cubrir las declaraciones oficiales sobre cuál sería la política de incentivos fiscales para el agricultor.",186.9,203.76,36,{"idx":373,"utterance_id":374,"speaker_name":176,"text":375,"start_s":376,"end_s":377,"word_count":378,"indexable":179},34,"72114","Que el gran mensaje que se estaba transmitiendo al público y lo que hacía que la gente votara por él no eran... los incentivos fiscales para el productor de soja, no era cómo iba a trabajar en política exterior; no son esas cosas de la vieja política, en el buen sentido de vieja política, de un programa de gobierno, de que analices un programa de gobierno.",204.96,224.78,67,{"idx":380,"utterance_id":381,"speaker_name":176,"text":382,"start_s":383,"end_s":384,"word_count":60,"indexable":179},35,"72115","La guerra se estaba ganando con ese nuevo tipo de arma, esa comunicación directa, que eran tweets sucios y horrorosos y fake news.",225.44,235.7,{"idx":371,"utterance_id":386,"speaker_name":176,"text":387,"start_s":388,"end_s":389,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},"72116","Al principio parecía poco noble cubrir eso.",239.68,242.6,{"idx":171,"utterance_id":391,"speaker_name":176,"text":392,"start_s":393,"end_s":394,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},"72117","Parecía que eso era chisme.",242.66,244.12,{"idx":396,"utterance_id":397,"speaker_name":176,"text":398,"start_s":399,"end_s":400,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},38,"72118","Parecía que la prensa hablar de eso era estar hablando de algo de poco interés.",244.62,247.2,{"idx":402,"utterance_id":403,"speaker_name":176,"text":404,"start_s":405,"end_s":406,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},39,"72119","No debemos rebajarnos a un nivel tan bajo.",247.44,250.48,{"idx":408,"utterance_id":409,"speaker_name":176,"text":410,"start_s":411,"end_s":412,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},40,"72120","Hablemos de las cosas serias.",250.54,251.82,{"idx":414,"utterance_id":415,"speaker_name":176,"text":416,"start_s":417,"end_s":418,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},41,"72121","Pero la cosa seria era lo que estaba en un nivel tan bajo.",251.88,254.44,{"idx":420,"utterance_id":421,"speaker_name":176,"text":422,"start_s":423,"end_s":424,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},42,"72122","Como lo que está pasando ahora.",254.76,256.4,{"idx":426,"utterance_id":427,"speaker_name":176,"text":428,"start_s":429,"end_s":430,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},43,"72123","Entonces, creo que la prensa tardó en entender esto.",257.2,259.36,{"idx":293,"utterance_id":432,"speaker_name":176,"text":433,"start_s":434,"end_s":435,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},"72124","Y me incluyo; y no solo la prensa, todo el mundo tardó en entender.",259.52,263.3,{"idx":437,"utterance_id":438,"speaker_name":176,"text":439,"start_s":440,"end_s":441,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},45,"72125","Todavía estamos conmocionados.",264.6,267.72,{"idx":443,"utterance_id":444,"speaker_name":176,"text":445,"start_s":446,"end_s":447,"word_count":317,"indexable":179},46,"72126","que el presidente haga un comentario en Facebook o en Twitter ofendiendo a la mujer, diciendo que la mujer del presidente de Francia es fea.",268.18,279.08,{"idx":449,"utterance_id":450,"speaker_name":176,"text":451,"start_s":452,"end_s":453,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},47,"72127","Es algo tan bizarro.",279.66,281.38,{"idx":455,"utterance_id":456,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":457,"start_s":458,"end_s":459,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},48,"72128","Y así, desde el Brasil pos-88, dirías, ¿te sentiste más a gusto en algún momento?",281.92,292.22,{"idx":461,"utterance_id":462,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":463,"start_s":464,"end_s":465,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},49,"72129","¿Sentiste esperanza de un país que cambiaba?",292.26,296.04,{"idx":467,"utterance_id":468,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":469,"start_s":470,"end_s":471,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},50,"72130","Tú... En fin, ¿estás menos esperanzado hoy que en algún momento anterior?",297.02,302.64,{"idx":473,"utterance_id":474,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":475,"start_s":476,"end_s":477,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},51,"72131","¿Y por qué?",303.74,304.2,{"idx":479,"utterance_id":480,"speaker_name":176,"text":481,"start_s":482,"end_s":483,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},52,"72132","No me sentía esperanzado en el Brasil pos-88, hasta que vi en lo que se convirtió el Brasil pos-2016.",306.64,316.68,{"idx":485,"utterance_id":486,"speaker_name":176,"text":487,"start_s":488,"end_s":489,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},53,"72133","Una especie de esperanza regresa.",316.74,320.24,{"idx":491,"utterance_id":492,"speaker_name":176,"text":493,"start_s":494,"end_s":495,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},54,"72134","Era feliz y no lo sabía, por así decirlo.",320.3,322.42,{"idx":497,"utterance_id":498,"speaker_name":176,"text":499,"start_s":500,"end_s":501,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},55,"72135","Hoy veo que Brasil mejoraba.",323.7,325.34,{"idx":503,"utterance_id":504,"speaker_name":176,"text":505,"start_s":506,"end_s":507,"word_count":508,"indexable":179},56,"72136","Y algo en lo que siempre insistí, en las semejanzas que existían entre el gobierno del PSDB y el PT y el PSDB, en la estupidez del antagonismo entre el PT y el PSDB, lo que vivimos hoy es resultado de que el PT y el PSDB, los socialdemócratas, no consiguieron unirse, tuvieron que unirse a serpientes y después perdieron el control de esas serpientes, esas serpientes se los comieron.",325.72,349.64,69,{"idx":510,"utterance_id":511,"speaker_name":176,"text":512,"start_s":513,"end_s":514,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},57,"72137","Entonces, veo que... Era muy agonizante porque el cambio era muy lento.",351.5,357.52,{"idx":516,"utterance_id":517,"speaker_name":176,"text":518,"start_s":519,"end_s":520,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},58,"72138","Brasil es un país muy injusto, muy nefasto.",358.42,362.78,{"idx":522,"utterance_id":523,"speaker_name":176,"text":524,"start_s":525,"end_s":526,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},59,"72139","Entonces el cambio era lento y queríamos que fuera más rápido.",363.54,366.18,{"idx":528,"utterance_id":529,"speaker_name":176,"text":530,"start_s":531,"end_s":532,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},60,"72140","Pero cuando miramos atrás, decimos que estaba ocurriendo un cambio.",366.6,370.22,{"idx":534,"utterance_id":535,"speaker_name":176,"text":536,"start_s":537,"end_s":538,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},61,"72141","Hubo personas interesadas en mejorar Brasil y el mundo en estos últimos 30 años.",370.26,376.62,{"idx":540,"utterance_id":541,"speaker_name":176,"text":542,"start_s":543,"end_s":544,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},62,"72142","Y ahora tenemos personas acelerando para empeorar y para destruir lo poco que conseguimos construir.",376.68,382.1,{"idx":546,"utterance_id":547,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":548,"start_s":549,"end_s":550,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},63,"72143","Y en la elección de Bolsonaro, ¿recuerdas dónde estabas cuando salió el resultado?",383.3,389.04,{"idx":552,"utterance_id":553,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":554,"start_s":555,"end_s":556,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},64,"72144","¿Qué te...?",389.08,391.84,{"idx":558,"utterance_id":559,"speaker_name":176,"text":560,"start_s":561,"end_s":562,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},65,"72145","Tenía la certeza de que él iba a ganar.",392.14,393.7,{"idx":564,"utterance_id":565,"speaker_name":176,"text":566,"start_s":567,"end_s":568,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},66,"72146","¿Desde cuándo?",394.46,395.18,{"idx":378,"utterance_id":570,"speaker_name":176,"text":571,"start_s":572,"end_s":573,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},"72147","¿Desde la puñalada?",395.88,396.76,{"idx":575,"utterance_id":576,"speaker_name":176,"text":577,"start_s":578,"end_s":579,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},68,"72148","Tuve la certeza de que algo así iba a suceder desde que Dilma le ganó a Aécio.",396.92,403.42,{"idx":508,"utterance_id":581,"speaker_name":176,"text":582,"start_s":583,"end_s":584,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},"72149","En la elección de Dilma contra Aécio, escribí una columna el día de la elección diciendo:",404.42,411.42,{"idx":586,"utterance_id":587,"speaker_name":176,"text":588,"start_s":589,"end_s":590,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},70,"72150","No voté por Aécio, pero me hubiera gustado que él ganara.",412.26,414.72,{"idx":592,"utterance_id":593,"speaker_name":176,"text":594,"start_s":595,"end_s":596,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},71,"72151","Lo recuerdo.",415.46,415.84,{"idx":598,"utterance_id":599,"speaker_name":176,"text":600,"start_s":601,"end_s":602,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},72,"72152","Porque si la oposición, en ese momento, está inclinándose hacia la derecha de esta manera, y lo que vendrá de Dilma, todo el mundo sabía, iba a ser malo.",416.06,427.3,{"idx":604,"utterance_id":605,"speaker_name":176,"text":606,"start_s":607,"end_s":608,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},73,"72153","Lo que ella dijo en las elecciones era mentira.",428.56,430.66,{"idx":610,"utterance_id":611,"speaker_name":176,"text":612,"start_s":613,"end_s":614,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},74,"72154","La economía brasileña estaba hecha un desastre.",430.7,432.42,{"idx":616,"utterance_id":617,"speaker_name":176,"text":618,"start_s":619,"end_s":620,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},75,"72155","Ella fue y puso a Joaquim Levi.",432.84,434.22,{"idx":622,"utterance_id":623,"speaker_name":176,"text":624,"start_s":625,"end_s":626,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},76,"72156","La derecha brasileña será cocinada a baño María durante esos cuatro años y quedará con odio.",435.36,441.64,{"idx":628,"utterance_id":629,"speaker_name":176,"text":630,"start_s":631,"end_s":632,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},77,"72157","Y con odio, y con odio, y elegirá a alguien como Bolsonaro.",442.18,445.66,{"idx":634,"utterance_id":635,"speaker_name":176,"text":636,"start_s":637,"end_s":638,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},78,"72158","Escribí eso.",445.7,446.54,{"idx":640,"utterance_id":641,"speaker_name":176,"text":642,"start_s":643,"end_s":644,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},79,"72159","Bolsonaro va a venir en el hombro... Semanas después, en 2014.",447.12,449.92,{"idx":646,"utterance_id":647,"speaker_name":176,"text":648,"start_s":649,"end_s":650,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},80,"72160","Lo escribí el día de la elección.",449.96,452.12,{"idx":652,"utterance_id":653,"speaker_name":176,"text":654,"start_s":655,"end_s":656,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},81,"72161","El día de la elección.",452.3,453,{"idx":658,"utterance_id":659,"speaker_name":176,"text":660,"start_s":661,"end_s":662,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},82,"72162","Recuerdo esa columna.",453.04,454.88,{"idx":664,"utterance_id":665,"speaker_name":176,"text":666,"start_s":667,"end_s":668,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},83,"72163","Sí, porque era obvio, era obvio.",455.02,457.28,{"idx":670,"utterance_id":671,"speaker_name":176,"text":672,"start_s":673,"end_s":674,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},84,"72164","Existía un odio histórico hacia la izquierda brasileña, que siempre existió.",457.86,464.78,{"idx":676,"utterance_id":677,"speaker_name":176,"text":678,"start_s":679,"end_s":680,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},85,"72165","El PT contribuyó enormemente a ese odio.",466.3,469.96,{"idx":682,"utterance_id":683,"speaker_name":176,"text":684,"start_s":685,"end_s":686,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},86,"72166","al final de su gobierno y con todas las cuestiones que la Lava Jato mostró, e insistió en el error ahí.",470.9,480.66,{"idx":688,"utterance_id":689,"speaker_name":176,"text":690,"start_s":691,"end_s":692,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},87,"72167","En ese momento quería mucho que Aécio ganara.",480.72,483.1,{"idx":694,"utterance_id":695,"speaker_name":176,"text":696,"start_s":697,"end_s":698,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},88,"72168","Si Aécio hubiera ganado, no tendría sentido un tipo como Bolsonaro.",483.14,489.26,{"idx":700,"utterance_id":701,"speaker_name":176,"text":702,"start_s":703,"end_s":704,"word_count":21,"indexable":179},89,"72169","Si se hubieran aplicado medidas liberales dentro de la democracia, ese discurso airado y nefasto que vivimos ahora no tendría sentido.",489.96,497.7,{"idx":706,"utterance_id":707,"speaker_name":176,"text":708,"start_s":709,"end_s":710,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},90,"72170","Entonces, ya llevaba mucho tiempo sufriendo el duelo por la elección de Bolsonaro.",498.88,503.2,{"idx":712,"utterance_id":713,"speaker_name":176,"text":714,"start_s":715,"end_s":716,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},91,"72171","¿Desde 2014?",504.26,505.24,{"idx":718,"utterance_id":719,"speaker_name":176,"text":720,"start_s":721,"end_s":722,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},92,"72172","Desde 2014, sí. Solo fue la confirmación de eso.",505.5,510.78,{"idx":724,"utterance_id":725,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":726,"start_s":727,"end_s":728,"word_count":43,"indexable":179},93,"72173","Ves, parece que hay un núcleo en el gobierno de Bolsonaro más expresivo; es obvio que es un reflejo del pensamiento del propio él, de los hijos, de Olavo de Carvalho.",514.14,524.92,{"idx":730,"utterance_id":731,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":732,"start_s":733,"end_s":734,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},94,"72174","Después quise saber si leíste algo de Olavo de Carvalho.",525.56,528.22,{"idx":736,"utterance_id":737,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":738,"start_s":739,"end_s":740,"word_count":301,"indexable":179},95,"72175","Pero el hecho es que parece que algunos ministerios tienen una alineación ideológica con esa narrativa más extravagante, llamémosla así.",528.92,540.82,{"idx":742,"utterance_id":743,"speaker_name":176,"text":744,"start_s":745,"end_s":746,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},96,"72176","Y quería saber si estás de acuerdo con eso.",542.88,545.02,{"idx":748,"utterance_id":749,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":750,"start_s":751,"end_s":752,"word_count":333,"indexable":179},97,"72177","Parece que medio ambiente, educación, derechos humanos y relaciones exteriores componen un cuadro ideológico que, de algún modo, ha sido la expresión de lo que es este gobierno.",545.6,562.56,{"idx":754,"utterance_id":755,"speaker_name":176,"text":756,"start_s":757,"end_s":758,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},98,"72178","No estoy diciendo que sea todo el gobierno.",562.64,564.2,{"idx":760,"utterance_id":761,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":762,"start_s":763,"end_s":764,"word_count":333,"indexable":179},99,"72179","De algún modo, parece un núcleo más representativo de ese pensamiento, si se puede llamar así, de lo que se discute en el día a día.",564.94,575.72,{"idx":766,"utterance_id":767,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":768,"start_s":769,"end_s":770,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},100,"72180","Cuando discutimos la persecución a líderes comunitarios, o a profesores, o la elección de rectores, o la comunidad LGBT, o la cuestión de la Amazonía.",576.56,588,{"idx":772,"utterance_id":773,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":774,"start_s":775,"end_s":776,"word_count":171,"indexable":179},101,"72181","o en nuestra interfaz con el mundo, ese núcleo parece que tiene una... Está más coherente con la narrativa presidencial que con el gobierno que la gente ni siquiera sabe muy bien si está funcionando o no.",588.64,602.98,{"idx":778,"utterance_id":779,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":780,"start_s":781,"end_s":782,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},102,"72182","Porque eso no es tema.",603.52,604.56,{"idx":784,"utterance_id":785,"speaker_name":176,"text":786,"start_s":787,"end_s":788,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},103,"72183","Pero eso fue lo que él vendió.",605.18,606.52,{"idx":790,"utterance_id":791,"speaker_name":176,"text":792,"start_s":793,"end_s":794,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},104,"72184","Por eso no se le puede acusar de estafa electoral.",607.6,609.92,{"idx":796,"utterance_id":797,"speaker_name":176,"text":798,"start_s":799,"end_s":800,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},105,"72185","Eso fue lo que prometió.",610.38,612.16,{"idx":802,"utterance_id":803,"speaker_name":176,"text":804,"start_s":805,"end_s":806,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},106,"72186","Y eso es lo que promete desde hace 30 años, desde hace 40 años.",612.44,615.88,{"idx":808,"utterance_id":809,"speaker_name":176,"text":810,"start_s":811,"end_s":812,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},107,"72187","27 años que él tuvo en la... Eso es lo que dice, eso es lo que siempre ha dicho.",615.9,622.06,{"idx":814,"utterance_id":815,"speaker_name":176,"text":816,"start_s":817,"end_s":818,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},108,"72188","¿Cuál es la sorpresa?",622.8,623.76,{"idx":820,"utterance_id":821,"speaker_name":176,"text":816,"start_s":822,"end_s":823,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},109,"72189",624.3,624.82,{"idx":825,"utterance_id":826,"speaker_name":176,"text":827,"start_s":828,"end_s":829,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},110,"72190","Volvió bien en el Inter ahí, ¿por qué no están escuchando lo que él está diciendo?",624.92,630.06,{"idx":831,"utterance_id":832,"speaker_name":176,"text":833,"start_s":834,"end_s":835,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},111,"72191","Hizo una carrera a partir de eso, una carrera basada en el odio, una carrera basada en la intolerancia.",632.06,636.44,{"idx":837,"utterance_id":838,"speaker_name":176,"text":839,"start_s":840,"end_s":841,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},112,"72192","Su discurso en la Paulista, la semana antes de ganar, cuando él amenazó con ponerte en la cárcel.",637.72,645.16,{"idx":843,"utterance_id":844,"speaker_name":176,"text":845,"start_s":846,"end_s":847,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},113,"72193","Y yo también, porque yo hacía",645.6,646.92,{"idx":849,"utterance_id":850,"speaker_name":176,"text":851,"start_s":852,"end_s":853,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},114,"72194","indirectamente, él dijo,",647.6,649.34,{"idx":855,"utterance_id":856,"speaker_name":176,"text":857,"start_s":858,"end_s":859,"word_count":586,"indexable":179},115,"72195","todos nosotros, toda persona que sea contra este gobierno, puede, saliendo de Brasil o yéndose hasta la punta de la playa, y en el momento que lo oí, pensé que 'punta de la playa' era para el exilio, para tomar un barco, y después descubrí que la 'punta de la playa' era donde la marina, el ejército en Río de Janeiro, mataba a los opositores políticos, es decir, en la semana anterior a la elección.",650.16,668.4,{"idx":861,"utterance_id":862,"speaker_name":176,"text":863,"start_s":864,"end_s":865,"word_count":333,"indexable":179},116,"72196","Dijo que o salíamos del país, o nos iban a asesinar como... a la gente fue asesinada durante la dictadura, ¿cuál es la sorpresa?",668.88,677.8,{"idx":867,"utterance_id":868,"speaker_name":176,"text":869,"start_s":870,"end_s":871,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},117,"72197","Eso es, él es eso.",680.82,681.92,{"idx":873,"utterance_id":874,"speaker_name":176,"text":875,"start_s":876,"end_s":877,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},118,"72198","Entonces, ahora tenemos que creer y trabajar para que nuestras deshilachadas, escasas e infames instituciones se mantengan.",682,694.04,{"idx":879,"utterance_id":880,"speaker_name":176,"text":881,"start_s":882,"end_s":883,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},119,"72199","¿Las instituciones están funcionando?",694.96,697.04,{"idx":885,"utterance_id":886,"speaker_name":176,"text":887,"start_s":888,"end_s":889,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},120,"72200","Sí, las instituciones brasileñas siempre han funcionado.",698,699.96,{"idx":891,"utterance_id":892,"speaker_name":176,"text":893,"start_s":894,"end_s":895,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},121,"72201","Mira lo que es Brasil, el país más desigual y más injusto del mundo.",700.04,703.3,{"idx":897,"utterance_id":898,"speaker_name":176,"text":899,"start_s":900,"end_s":901,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},122,"72202","Nuestras instituciones... Son ridículas, instituciones que mantienen la vergüenza que es Brasil desde hace 500 años.",703.5,711.78,{"idx":903,"utterance_id":904,"speaker_name":176,"text":905,"start_s":906,"end_s":907,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},123,"72203","Ahora, tenemos que aferrarnos a eso e intentar aguantar, hacer que él no consiga matarnos.",712.28,718.8,{"idx":909,"utterance_id":910,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":911,"start_s":912,"end_s":913,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},124,"72204","¿Es difícil escribir actualmente?",720.42,725.48,{"idx":915,"utterance_id":916,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":917,"start_s":918,"end_s":919,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},125,"72205","¿Es más difícil escribir o más fácil?",725.54,727.64,{"idx":921,"utterance_id":922,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":923,"start_s":924,"end_s":925,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},126,"72206","Es más difícil.",728.96,729.56,{"idx":927,"utterance_id":928,"speaker_name":176,"text":929,"start_s":930,"end_s":931,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},127,"72207","Es mucho más difícil porque...",730.14,731.34,{"idx":933,"utterance_id":934,"speaker_name":176,"text":935,"start_s":936,"end_s":937,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},128,"72208","En primer lugar... Porque no faltan temas, por eso es que estoy preguntando.",734.28,736.94,{"idx":939,"utterance_id":940,"speaker_name":176,"text":941,"start_s":942,"end_s":943,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},129,"72209","Y es paradójico, ¿no?",738.12,739.58,{"idx":945,"utterance_id":946,"speaker_name":176,"text":947,"start_s":948,"end_s":949,"word_count":9,"indexable":179},130,"72210","Sí, pero también la cuestión que se plantea ahora, durante mucho tiempo escribí, hasta hace tres, cuatro años, yo escribía para quien quisiera leerme.",739.7,748.5,{"idx":951,"utterance_id":952,"speaker_name":176,"text":953,"start_s":954,"end_s":955,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},131,"72211","Escribía el tema que estaba en mi cabeza, de la manera que yo quería.",749.24,751.94,{"idx":957,"utterance_id":958,"speaker_name":176,"text":959,"start_s":960,"end_s":961,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},132,"72212","Si a la gente le gustaba, perfecto; si no, no pasaba nada.",752.42,754.62,{"idx":963,"utterance_id":964,"speaker_name":176,"text":965,"start_s":966,"end_s":967,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},133,"72213","Ahora escribo con un enfoque, con un público objetivo.",755.4,759.26,{"idx":62,"utterance_id":969,"speaker_name":176,"text":970,"start_s":971,"end_s":972,"word_count":437,"indexable":179},"72214","Y ese público objetivo son el 30%, 40% que votaron por Bolsonaro y no son fascistas, y no creen que haya que matar al adversario, y no creen que el homosexual deba ser golpeado, y no piensan que haya que quitarle la tierra a los indígenas.",759.86,773.36,{"idx":974,"utterance_id":975,"speaker_name":176,"text":976,"start_s":977,"end_s":978,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},135,"72215","Me comunico con ellos.",774.02,775.34,{"idx":980,"utterance_id":981,"speaker_name":176,"text":982,"start_s":983,"end_s":984,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},136,"72216","Cuando usted santa hoy, ¿está con ese público o no con ese público?",775.86,778.64,{"idx":986,"utterance_id":987,"speaker_name":176,"text":988,"start_s":989,"end_s":990,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},137,"72217","Con ese público.",778.82,779.6,{"idx":992,"utterance_id":993,"speaker_name":176,"text":994,"start_s":995,"end_s":996,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},138,"72218","Creo que una cosa es que yo soy muy crítico con la izquierda.",779.96,782.16,{"idx":51,"utterance_id":998,"speaker_name":176,"text":999,"start_s":1000,"end_s":1001,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},"72219","hoy es que la izquierda sigue hablando para la izquierda.",782.26,785.14,{"idx":1003,"utterance_id":1004,"speaker_name":176,"text":1005,"start_s":1006,"end_s":1007,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},140,"72220","El 30% de la izquierda.",787.14,788.1,{"idx":1009,"utterance_id":1010,"speaker_name":176,"text":1011,"start_s":1012,"end_s":1013,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},141,"72221","Entonces hay un 30%.",788.28,789.16,{"idx":1015,"utterance_id":1016,"speaker_name":176,"text":1017,"start_s":1018,"end_s":1019,"word_count":21,"indexable":179},142,"72222","Lula libre, hay un 30%; 'quemen la Amazonía' y hay un 40% aquí que son las personas que votaron por Bolsonaro y no son horrorosas.",789.62,798.44,{"idx":1021,"utterance_id":1022,"speaker_name":176,"text":1023,"start_s":1024,"end_s":1025,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},143,"72223","Son las personas que eran antipetistas, que no querían y que querían otra cosa.",798.52,803.68,{"idx":1027,"utterance_id":1028,"speaker_name":176,"text":1029,"start_s":1030,"end_s":1031,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},144,"72224","Con esas personas tenemos que comunicarnos.",804.92,806.6,{"idx":1033,"utterance_id":1034,"speaker_name":176,"text":1035,"start_s":1036,"end_s":1037,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},145,"72225","Cuando escribo hoy, es para ellas que hablo.",806.64,808.48,{"idx":1039,"utterance_id":1040,"speaker_name":176,"text":1041,"start_s":1042,"end_s":1043,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},146,"72226","Y también hablo para la izquierda, para pelear con la izquierda.",809.96,813.56,{"idx":1045,"utterance_id":1046,"speaker_name":176,"text":1047,"start_s":1048,"end_s":1049,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},147,"72227","Para decirles, mira, no será con el discurso 'Lula libre'.",814.18,817.16,{"idx":1051,"utterance_id":1052,"speaker_name":176,"text":1053,"start_s":1054,"end_s":1055,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},148,"72228","que ustedes van a traer de vuelta a esas personas que votaron por Bolsonaro.",817.8,821.34,{"idx":39,"utterance_id":1057,"speaker_name":176,"text":1058,"start_s":1059,"end_s":1060,"word_count":333,"indexable":179},"72229","Entonces intento hablar con la izquierda, que es más mi burbuja, alertando sobre lo que creo que es importante, y hablar con esos, digamos, indecisos.",822.16,831.84,{"idx":1062,"utterance_id":1063,"speaker_name":176,"text":1064,"start_s":1065,"end_s":1066,"word_count":171,"indexable":179},150,"72230","Porque lo que sucede es que esos 40% miran las cosas de Bolsonaro, quedan horrorizados y arrepentidos de haber votado a Bolsonaro, pero miran a la izquierda y ven a Glaze yendo en la apuesta de Maduro.",831.9,844.7,{"idx":1068,"utterance_id":1069,"speaker_name":176,"text":1070,"start_s":1071,"end_s":1072,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},151,"72231","Y entonces creen que con el PT (Partido de los Trabajadores) Brasil se iba a convertir en una Venezuela.",845.42,849.8,{"idx":1074,"utterance_id":1075,"speaker_name":176,"text":1076,"start_s":1077,"end_s":1078,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},152,"72232","No iba a pasar nada.",849.86,850.32,{"idx":1080,"utterance_id":1081,"speaker_name":176,"text":1076,"start_s":1082,"end_s":1083,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},153,"72233",850.68,851.52,{"idx":1085,"utterance_id":1086,"speaker_name":176,"text":1087,"start_s":1088,"end_s":1089,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},154,"72234","El PT (Partido de los Trabajadores) cometió miles de errores.",851.64,853.16,{"idx":1091,"utterance_id":1092,"speaker_name":176,"text":1093,"start_s":1094,"end_s":1095,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},155,"72235","Pero Lula fortaleció las instituciones, el Ministerio Público y la Policía Federal, que terminaron arrestándolo.",853.54,859.08,{"idx":1097,"utterance_id":1098,"speaker_name":176,"text":1099,"start_s":1100,"end_s":1101,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},156,"72236","Es lo contrario de Venezuela.",860.04,861.2,{"idx":1103,"utterance_id":1104,"speaker_name":176,"text":1105,"start_s":1106,"end_s":1107,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},157,"72237","Pero cuando Glaze va a la toma de posesión de Maduro, no se puede discutir con la persona que votó por Bolsonaro.",861.26,868.22,{"idx":1109,"utterance_id":1110,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1111,"start_s":1112,"end_s":1113,"word_count":43,"indexable":179},158,"72238","Y en ese diálogo tuyo que está mediado con ese público, ¿sientes... En estos seis meses, más apertura para que la gente se rinda a determinados argumentos?",868.82,884.2,{"idx":1115,"utterance_id":1116,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1117,"start_s":1118,"end_s":1119,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},159,"72239","¿O crees que la gente todavía está muy bloqueada en sus posiciones originales?",885.04,889.24,{"idx":1121,"utterance_id":1122,"speaker_name":176,"text":1123,"start_s":1124,"end_s":1125,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},160,"72240","Lo percibo.",889.34,889.96,{"idx":1127,"utterance_id":1128,"speaker_name":176,"text":1129,"start_s":1130,"end_s":1131,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},161,"72241","¿Percibo apertura?",890.88,891.66,{"idx":1133,"utterance_id":1134,"speaker_name":176,"text":1135,"start_s":1136,"end_s":1137,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},162,"72242","Percibo apertura.",891.76,892.28,{"idx":1139,"utterance_id":1140,"speaker_name":176,"text":1141,"start_s":1142,"end_s":1143,"word_count":408,"indexable":179},163,"72243","Hice una crónica también muy optimista sobre eso, cuyo título era 'Bolsonaro va a unir a Brasil', porque creo que el encuadre quedó tan nefasto, que... Mucha gente que estaba en polos opuestos ahora se aproxima.",892.32,910.84,{"idx":1145,"utterance_id":1146,"speaker_name":176,"text":1147,"start_s":1148,"end_s":1149,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},164,"72244","La distancia que hay entre Boulos y Armínio Fraga es esa.",912.28,916.4,{"idx":1151,"utterance_id":1152,"speaker_name":176,"text":1153,"start_s":1154,"end_s":1155,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},165,"72245","Y la que ambos tienen respecto a Bolsonaro es esa.",916.62,918.34,{"idx":1157,"utterance_id":1158,"speaker_name":176,"text":1159,"start_s":1160,"end_s":1161,"word_count":283,"indexable":179},166,"72246","Boulos y Armínio Fraga tienen mucho más en común entre sí que lo que tienen con Bolsonaro.",919.32,924,{"idx":1163,"utterance_id":1164,"speaker_name":176,"text":1165,"start_s":1166,"end_s":1167,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},167,"72247","Entonces, creo que el abanico se abre.",924.06,926.3,{"idx":1169,"utterance_id":1170,"speaker_name":176,"text":1171,"start_s":1172,"end_s":1173,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},168,"72248","Y hay esa percepción de mucha gente del tipo: tenemos que hacer las alianzas posibles con quien está a favor...",927.26,933.62,{"idx":1175,"utterance_id":1176,"speaker_name":176,"text":1177,"start_s":1178,"end_s":1179,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},169,"72249","de la civilización, quien está a favor de la democracia, quien está a favor del Estado de Derecho.",934.2,938.2,{"idx":1181,"utterance_id":1182,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1183,"start_s":1184,"end_s":1185,"word_count":408,"indexable":179},170,"72250","Ante esa amenaza civilizatoria, no podemos correr el riesgo de dejar de discutir diferencias que son importantes desde el punto de vista democrático para la construcción de una salida a los 500 años de desigualdad, intolerancia y violencia que hemos sufrido.",938.82,958.96,{"idx":1187,"utterance_id":1188,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1189,"start_s":1190,"end_s":1191,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},171,"72251","Es obvio que no es papel del escritor.",960.08,962.6,{"idx":1193,"utterance_id":1194,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1195,"start_s":1196,"end_s":1197,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},172,"72252","decir cómo debe comportarse el político.",963.12,965.66,{"idx":1199,"utterance_id":1200,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1201,"start_s":1202,"end_s":1203,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},173,"72253","Pero ¿cuál es tu percepción?",966.58,968.24,{"idx":1205,"utterance_id":1206,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1207,"start_s":1208,"end_s":1209,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},174,"72254","Porque usted es escritor, pero es ciudadano, usted vota, usted participa, usted interviene en el debate público.",968.32,974.56,{"idx":1211,"utterance_id":1212,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1213,"start_s":1214,"end_s":1215,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},175,"72255","¿Cómo lidiar con esas capas tan diferentes de la realidad?",976.1,981.2,{"idx":1217,"utterance_id":1218,"speaker_name":176,"text":1219,"start_s":1220,"end_s":1221,"word_count":350,"indexable":179},176,"72256","Mira, no sé desde vuestro punto de vista, pero desde mi punto de vista como elector, en este caso, creo que ustedes tienen que renunciar.",981.92,990,{"idx":1223,"utterance_id":1224,"speaker_name":176,"text":1225,"start_s":1226,"end_s":1227,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},177,"72257","Arminio Fraga tiene que renunciar y Boulos tiene que renunciar.",991.4,993.92,{"idx":45,"utterance_id":1229,"speaker_name":176,"text":1230,"start_s":1231,"end_s":1232,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},"72258","Es decir, es obvio que si hubiera un gobierno absolutamente milagroso en el que estuvieran Boulos y Arminio Fraga juntos, tendrían que encontrar un terreno común.",994.04,1004.64,{"idx":1234,"utterance_id":1235,"speaker_name":176,"text":1236,"start_s":1237,"end_s":1238,"word_count":21,"indexable":179},179,"72259","Me parece mucho más positivo que los socialdemócratas y la izquierda renuncien cada uno a una parte para que podamos tener un gobierno de...",1007.6,1016.6,{"idx":1240,"utterance_id":1241,"speaker_name":176,"text":1242,"start_s":1243,"end_s":1244,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},180,"72260","¿Estás pensando en un gobierno de reconstrucción?",1016.64,1019.76,{"idx":1246,"utterance_id":1247,"speaker_name":176,"text":1248,"start_s":1249,"end_s":1250,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},181,"72261","De reconstrucción, porque mira lo que estamos viendo.",1019.8,1023,{"idx":1252,"utterance_id":1253,"speaker_name":176,"text":1254,"start_s":1255,"end_s":1256,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},182,"72262","Estamos viendo a un tipo que amenazó con matar a los opositores durante toda la vida.",1023.08,1028,{"idx":1258,"utterance_id":1259,"speaker_name":176,"text":1260,"start_s":1261,"end_s":1262,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},183,"72263","Y las muertes de los pobres, al menos, ya empezaron y son mucho mayores.",1029.22,1034,{"idx":1264,"utterance_id":1265,"speaker_name":176,"text":1266,"start_s":1267,"end_s":1268,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},184,"72264","Las muertes por la policía en Río de Janeiro.",1034.04,1035.64,{"idx":1270,"utterance_id":1271,"speaker_name":176,"text":1272,"start_s":1273,"end_s":1274,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},185,"72265","Mataron a seis chicos en Río de Janeiro la semana pasada.",1036.86,1041,{"idx":365,"utterance_id":1276,"speaker_name":176,"text":1277,"start_s":1278,"end_s":1279,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},"72266","Seis chicos inocentes, chicos yendo a la escuela, chicos yendo al fútbol.",1041.18,1044.86,{"idx":1281,"utterance_id":1282,"speaker_name":176,"text":1283,"start_s":1284,"end_s":1285,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},187,"72267","La policía está entrando y matando.",1045.58,1047.28,{"idx":1287,"utterance_id":1288,"speaker_name":176,"text":1289,"start_s":1290,"end_s":1291,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},188,"72268","Es muy grave lo que está ocurriendo.",1049.86,1051.12,{"idx":1293,"utterance_id":1294,"speaker_name":176,"text":1295,"start_s":1296,"end_s":1297,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},189,"72269","Entonces, es esto o aquello.",1051.16,1053.28,{"idx":11,"utterance_id":1299,"speaker_name":176,"text":1300,"start_s":1301,"end_s":1302,"word_count":344,"indexable":179},"72270","El libro 'Cómo mueren las democracias', de Levitsky, muestra cómo en el ascenso del fascismo y del nazismo en la década de los 30, algunos países lograron hacer esas alianzas.",1054.26,1067.88,{"idx":1304,"utterance_id":1305,"speaker_name":176,"text":1306,"start_s":1307,"end_s":1308,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},191,"72271","Así, los socialdemócratas se unieron a los socialistas, partidos de democracia cristiana se unieron a la izquierda.",1068.5,1075.86,{"idx":1310,"utterance_id":1311,"speaker_name":176,"text":1312,"start_s":1313,"end_s":1314,"word_count":43,"indexable":179},192,"72272","Hubo ajustes allí para que personas que aceptaran el pacto democrático no se unieran a aquellas que pensaban más parecido con ellas en términos políticos, pero aceptaban la barbarie.",1078.2,1093.38,{"idx":1316,"utterance_id":1317,"speaker_name":176,"text":1318,"start_s":1319,"end_s":1320,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},193,"72273","Eso sucedió en Bélgica, sucedió en Finlandia, sucedió en algunos países.",1094.58,1098.24,{"idx":1322,"utterance_id":1323,"speaker_name":176,"text":1324,"start_s":1325,"end_s":1326,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},194,"72274","Entonces, creo que tenemos que pensar.",1098.28,1099.72,{"idx":1328,"utterance_id":1329,"speaker_name":176,"text":1330,"start_s":1331,"end_s":1332,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},195,"72275","Las reglas han cambiado, la situación cambió.",1101.64,1103.28,{"idx":1334,"utterance_id":1335,"speaker_name":176,"text":1336,"start_s":1337,"end_s":1338,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},196,"72276","Es una situación de emergencia.",1103.52,1105.1,{"idx":56,"utterance_id":1340,"speaker_name":176,"text":1336,"start_s":1341,"end_s":1342,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},"72277",1106.1,1107.42,{"idx":1344,"utterance_id":1345,"speaker_name":176,"text":1346,"start_s":1347,"end_s":1348,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},198,"72278","La cuestión es así, pero, gente, no se puede andar 20 kilómetros en una balsa inflable.",1107.68,1112.7,{"idx":1350,"utterance_id":1351,"speaker_name":176,"text":1352,"start_s":1353,"end_s":1354,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},199,"72279","Pero el barco se está hundiendo.",1113.14,1114.48,{"idx":1356,"utterance_id":1357,"speaker_name":176,"text":1358,"start_s":1359,"end_s":1360,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},200,"72280","Vamos a tener que subir al bote inflable y recorrer 20 kilómetros.",1114.6,1117.02,{"idx":1362,"utterance_id":1363,"speaker_name":176,"text":1364,"start_s":1365,"end_s":1366,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},201,"72281","Creo que es así.",1117.2,1117.84,{"idx":1368,"utterance_id":1369,"speaker_name":176,"text":1370,"start_s":1371,"end_s":1372,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},202,"72282","Va muy rápido y no sabemos hacia dónde vamos.",1119.42,1122.54,{"idx":1374,"utterance_id":1375,"speaker_name":176,"text":1376,"start_s":1377,"end_s":1378,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},203,"72283","Sabemos que las cosas se están degradando.",1123.04,1124.96,{"idx":1380,"utterance_id":1381,"speaker_name":176,"text":1382,"start_s":1383,"end_s":1384,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},204,"72284","El asunto de la Amazonía, ya estamos viviendo los efectos del calentamiento global.",1125.24,1131.16,{"idx":1386,"utterance_id":1387,"speaker_name":176,"text":1388,"start_s":1389,"end_s":1390,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},205,"72285","Tardamos mucho en despertarnos para esto.",1131.68,1134.58,{"idx":1392,"utterance_id":1393,"speaker_name":176,"text":1394,"start_s":1395,"end_s":1396,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},206,"72286","Yo tardé.",1135.16,1135.9,{"idx":1398,"utterance_id":1399,"speaker_name":176,"text":1400,"start_s":1401,"end_s":1402,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},207,"72287","Imagino que tú también.",1136.04,1136.94,{"idx":1404,"utterance_id":1405,"speaker_name":176,"text":1406,"start_s":1407,"end_s":1408,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},208,"72288","El mundo se está acabando.",1138.28,1139.54,{"idx":1410,"utterance_id":1411,"speaker_name":176,"text":1412,"start_s":1413,"end_s":1414,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},209,"72289","Es decir, el mundo no va a acabar.",1139.7,1140.56,{"idx":1416,"utterance_id":1417,"speaker_name":176,"text":1418,"start_s":1419,"end_s":1420,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},210,"72290","El mundo va a seguir ahí.",1141,1142.58,{"idx":1422,"utterance_id":1423,"speaker_name":176,"text":1424,"start_s":1425,"end_s":1426,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},211,"72291","Nosotros nos estamos acabando.",1142.98,1143.86,{"idx":1428,"utterance_id":1429,"speaker_name":176,"text":1424,"start_s":1430,"end_s":1431,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},212,"72292",1143.9,1145,{"idx":1433,"utterance_id":1434,"speaker_name":176,"text":1435,"start_s":1436,"end_s":1437,"word_count":283,"indexable":179},213,"72293","Si seguimos así, la vida dentro de 50 años será un infierno en la Tierra.",1146.12,1150.76,{"idx":1439,"utterance_id":1440,"speaker_name":176,"text":1441,"start_s":1442,"end_s":1443,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},214,"72294","Habrá grandes franjas tropicales en las que no se podrá sembrar, no se podrá producir comida.",1151.26,1155.94,{"idx":1445,"utterance_id":1446,"speaker_name":176,"text":1447,"start_s":1448,"end_s":1449,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},215,"72295","Y entonces habrá una migración masiva que aumentará la xenofobia, que provocará guerras.",1156.04,1160.2,{"idx":1451,"utterance_id":1452,"speaker_name":176,"text":1453,"start_s":1454,"end_s":1455,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},216,"72296","Ese es el mundo con el que estamos lidiando.",1161.52,1162.58,{"idx":1457,"utterance_id":1458,"speaker_name":176,"text":1459,"start_s":1460,"end_s":1461,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},217,"72297","Tiene que ser algo así como... ¿Te parece interesante, en Estados Unidos, cuando proponen el Green New Deal?",1162.82,1166.96,{"idx":1463,"utterance_id":1464,"speaker_name":176,"text":1465,"start_s":1466,"end_s":1467,"word_count":27,"indexable":179},218,"72298","Aunque sea algo radical de la izquierda de allá y tal, es como un Plan Marshall que tiene que hacerse ahora, para frenar la destrucción del mundo y la política en Brasil.",1168.56,1182.44,{"idx":1469,"utterance_id":1470,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1471,"start_s":1472,"end_s":1473,"word_count":9,"indexable":179},219,"72299","Solo te voy a hacer esta pregunta porque tienes un grado de distanciamiento del asunto que creo que puede interesar a quienes nos están escuchando.",1183.44,1189.48,{"idx":1475,"utterance_id":1476,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1477,"start_s":1478,"end_s":1479,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},220,"72300","Lava Jato, Vaza Jato.",1191.04,1192.62,{"idx":1481,"utterance_id":1482,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1483,"start_s":1484,"end_s":1485,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},221,"72301","¿Crees que hubo exageros?",1192.66,1195.56,{"idx":1487,"utterance_id":1488,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1489,"start_s":1490,"end_s":1491,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},222,"72302","¿Crees que hubo politización en algún... en algún sentido?",1195.8,1200.54,{"idx":1493,"utterance_id":1494,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1495,"start_s":1496,"end_s":1497,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},223,"72303","¿Crees que todo está bien?",1200.58,1202.56,{"idx":1499,"utterance_id":1500,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1501,"start_s":1502,"end_s":1503,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},224,"72304","En fin, ¿cómo lo recibes?",1203.56,1205.72,{"idx":1505,"utterance_id":1506,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1507,"start_s":1508,"end_s":1509,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},225,"72305","Estás leyendo periódicos, te estás informando tanto como nosotros.",1205.76,1210.62,{"idx":1511,"utterance_id":1512,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1513,"start_s":1514,"end_s":1515,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},226,"72306","¿Cuál es tu percepción?",1211.28,1212.44,{"idx":1517,"utterance_id":1518,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1519,"start_s":1520,"end_s":1521,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},227,"72307","Habías dicho que el PT fortaleció las instituciones y acabó sufriendo consecuencias de eso también.",1213.54,1222.82,{"idx":1523,"utterance_id":1524,"speaker_name":176,"text":1525,"start_s":1526,"end_s":1527,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},228,"72308","¿Cómo ves eso?",1223.22,1224.68,{"idx":17,"utterance_id":1529,"speaker_name":176,"text":1530,"start_s":1531,"end_s":1532,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},"72309","Creo que tenemos que salir del flaflu de ser... Yo soy Lava Jato, yo soy Vaza Jato.",1225.22,1233.86,{"idx":1534,"utterance_id":1535,"speaker_name":176,"text":1536,"start_s":1537,"end_s":1538,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},230,"72310","Creo que es ese tipo de dicotomía que no nos lleva a nada.",1234.2,1237.5,{"idx":1540,"utterance_id":1541,"speaker_name":176,"text":1542,"start_s":1543,"end_s":1544,"word_count":21,"indexable":179},231,"72311","Entonces, es evidente que la Lava Jato hizo un bien gigante para Brasil, poniendo por primera vez en Brasil a ricos en la cárcel.",1238.32,1249.2,{"idx":1546,"utterance_id":1547,"speaker_name":176,"text":1548,"start_s":1549,"end_s":1550,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},232,"72312","No existían ricos en la cárcel.",1249.42,1251.26,{"idx":1552,"utterance_id":1553,"speaker_name":176,"text":1554,"start_s":1555,"end_s":1556,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},233,"72313","Eso es algo revolucionario.",1251.94,1253.96,{"idx":1558,"utterance_id":1559,"speaker_name":176,"text":1560,"start_s":1561,"end_s":1562,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},234,"72314","Ahora, también es evidente que lo hizo de maneras ilegales.",1254.9,1258.5,{"idx":1564,"utterance_id":1565,"speaker_name":176,"text":1566,"start_s":1567,"end_s":1568,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},235,"72315","Lo vemos por la Vaza Jato ahora, pero ya se sabía antes.",1258.92,1262.4,{"idx":1570,"utterance_id":1571,"speaker_name":176,"text":1572,"start_s":1573,"end_s":1574,"word_count":9,"indexable":179},236,"72316","Con prisiones temporales ilegales, con conducción coercitiva ilegal, con escuchas ilegales, con filtración de escuchas ilegales, con varios artificios ilegales e inmorales, así que ni hablar.",1263.54,1277.08,{"idx":1576,"utterance_id":1577,"speaker_name":176,"text":1578,"start_s":1579,"end_s":1580,"word_count":317,"indexable":179},237,"72317","Entonces, es necesario mirar todos estos acontecimientos y... pensar qué está bien y qué está mal en cada lado.",1278.78,1287.62,{"idx":1582,"utterance_id":1583,"speaker_name":176,"text":1584,"start_s":1585,"end_s":1586,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},238,"72318","No podemos... Porque eso es lo que va embruteciendo el debate.",1287.66,1291.06,{"idx":1588,"utterance_id":1589,"speaker_name":176,"text":1590,"start_s":1591,"end_s":1592,"word_count":21,"indexable":179},239,"72319","Si negamos que la Lava Jato tuvo cualquier beneficio para Brasil, que cualquiera se siente y diga eso, es una locura.",1292.52,1298.4,{"idx":1594,"utterance_id":1595,"speaker_name":176,"text":1596,"start_s":1597,"end_s":1598,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},240,"72320","Desbarató un montón de esquemas de corrupción.",1299.56,1301.66,{"idx":1600,"utterance_id":1601,"speaker_name":176,"text":1602,"start_s":1603,"end_s":1604,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},241,"72321","Y puso a personas culpables en la cárcel.",1302.6,1304.38,{"idx":1606,"utterance_id":1607,"speaker_name":176,"text":1608,"start_s":1609,"end_s":1610,"word_count":293,"indexable":179},242,"72322","Si negamos que un tipo, el juez, que hablaba con el Ministerio Público y orientaba al Ministerio Público para perseguir al candidato que... perdió las elecciones frente al otro y él se volvió el ministro de Justicia de ese candidato y está todo bien.",1304.94,1318.84,{"idx":1612,"utterance_id":1613,"speaker_name":176,"text":1614,"start_s":1615,"end_s":1616,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},243,"72323","Eso es una bananada, una república bananera ridícula.",1318.9,1324.14,{"idx":23,"utterance_id":1618,"speaker_name":176,"text":1619,"start_s":1620,"end_s":1621,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},"72324","Entonces, creo que nosotros... Esa pelea entre los que están a favor o en contra es la que está estorbando todo.",1324.18,1331.94,{"idx":1623,"utterance_id":1624,"speaker_name":176,"text":1625,"start_s":1626,"end_s":1627,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},245,"72325","Y creo que en eso la izquierda perjudica mucho.",1332,1333.8,{"idx":1629,"utterance_id":1630,"speaker_name":176,"text":1631,"start_s":1632,"end_s":1633,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},246,"72326","Porque cuando la izquierda pone como foco de su acción... Por ejemplo, en la época del impeachment, la consigna de la izquierda era 'no va a haber golpe'.",1333.9,1342.82,{"idx":1635,"utterance_id":1636,"speaker_name":176,"text":1637,"start_s":1638,"end_s":1639,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},247,"72327","Y no miraba ningún problema del gobierno.",1345.24,1347.2,{"idx":1641,"utterance_id":1642,"speaker_name":176,"text":1643,"start_s":1644,"end_s":1645,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},248,"72328","No va a haber golpe, eso eclipsaba cualquier problema del gobierno de Dilma.",1347.26,1351.28,{"idx":1647,"utterance_id":1648,"speaker_name":176,"text":1649,"start_s":1650,"end_s":1651,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},249,"72329","Después era 'fuera Temer'.",1351.58,1352.94,{"idx":1653,"utterance_id":1654,"speaker_name":176,"text":1655,"start_s":1656,"end_s":1657,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},250,"72330","Y después era 'Lula libre'.",1353.56,1355.54,{"idx":1659,"utterance_id":1660,"speaker_name":176,"text":1661,"start_s":1662,"end_s":1663,"word_count":60,"indexable":179},251,"72331","Esos eslóganes alejan a esos 40%: a quienes son de izquierda, o a la socialdemocracia, o a las personas democráticas a las que hay que hablar.",1356.7,1363.94,{"idx":1665,"utterance_id":1666,"speaker_name":176,"text":1667,"start_s":1668,"end_s":1669,"word_count":181,"indexable":179},252,"72332","Aleja.",1364.4,1365.04,{"idx":1671,"utterance_id":1672,"speaker_name":176,"text":1673,"start_s":1674,"end_s":1675,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},253,"72333","Creo que el juicio de Lula fue ilegal.",1365.52,1369.86,{"idx":1677,"utterance_id":1678,"speaker_name":176,"text":1679,"start_s":1680,"end_s":1681,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},254,"72334","Eso no significa que yo crea, no sé, si él es inocente o no, pero la forma en que fue encarcelado fue ilegal.",1370.6,1375.7,{"idx":1683,"utterance_id":1684,"speaker_name":176,"text":1685,"start_s":1686,"end_s":1687,"word_count":497,"indexable":179},255,"72335","Pero la bandera 'Lula libre' no va a sacar a Bolsonaro del poder, no va a detener los absurdos que Bolsonaro está haciendo, y el mesianismo de Lula de vuelta, sebastianista, 'él va a volver a ser nuestro líder y va a resolver los problemas', creo que es un tiro en el pie, un tiro en el pie gigante.",1376.34,1396.6,{"idx":1689,"utterance_id":1690,"speaker_name":176,"text":1691,"start_s":1692,"end_s":1693,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},256,"72336","La izquierda tiene que encontrar un camino fuera de eso.",1396.94,1399.08,{"idx":1695,"utterance_id":1696,"speaker_name":176,"text":1697,"start_s":1698,"end_s":1699,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},257,"72337","Porque esos 40% no se van a aliar al 'Lula libre'.",1399.38,1402.82,{"idx":1701,"utterance_id":1702,"speaker_name":176,"text":1703,"start_s":1704,"end_s":1705,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},258,"72338","No lo harán.",1402.9,1403.28,{"idx":1707,"utterance_id":1708,"speaker_name":176,"text":1709,"start_s":1710,"end_s":1711,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},259,"72339","La fuerza política más fuerte de Brasil es el antipetismo, todavía.",1403.84,1407.96,{"idx":1713,"utterance_id":1714,"speaker_name":176,"text":1715,"start_s":1716,"end_s":1717,"word_count":60,"indexable":179},260,"72340","Puedes estar de acuerdo con ese antipetismo o estar en desacuerdo y pensar que eso fue creado por los medios o no fue creado por los medios.",1409.16,1414.52,{"idx":1719,"utterance_id":1720,"speaker_name":176,"text":1721,"start_s":1722,"end_s":1723,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},261,"72341","No importa.",1414.58,1415.12,{"idx":1725,"utterance_id":1726,"speaker_name":176,"text":1727,"start_s":1728,"end_s":1729,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},262,"72342","Así es como la gente está pensando hoy.",1415.48,1416.82,{"idx":1731,"utterance_id":1732,"speaker_name":176,"text":1733,"start_s":1734,"end_s":1735,"word_count":317,"indexable":179},263,"72343","Intentar captar a esos 40% de personas que no son fascistas y votaron a Bolsonaro y acercarlos al 'Lula libre' no va a funcionar.",1417.22,1422.1,{"idx":1737,"utterance_id":1738,"speaker_name":176,"text":1739,"start_s":1740,"end_s":1741,"word_count":283,"indexable":179},264,"72344","Solo vamos a reforzar... empujar de vuelta a los descontentos con el gobierno de Bolsonaro al regazo de Bolsonaro.",1422.4,1428.98,{"idx":1743,"utterance_id":1744,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1745,"start_s":1746,"end_s":1747,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},265,"72345","Ahora, por ejemplo, dices, metió a ricos en la cárcel.",1429.58,1433.58,{"idx":1749,"utterance_id":1750,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1751,"start_s":1752,"end_s":1753,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},266,"72346","Hay muy pocos ricos en la cárcel hoy.",1434.22,1436.06,{"idx":1755,"utterance_id":1756,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1757,"start_s":1758,"end_s":1759,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},267,"72347","Es decir, en poco tiempo las cosas empezaron a volver a la normalidad para los ricos, al menos.",1437.28,1444.66,{"idx":1761,"utterance_id":1762,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1763,"start_s":1764,"end_s":1765,"word_count":60,"indexable":179},268,"72348","La desigualdad está aumentando, el desempleo llegó a la estratosfera, rompimos gran parte de la... de la economía, sobre todo de la construcción civil, pesada y ligera.",1446.46,1455.92,{"idx":1767,"utterance_id":1768,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1769,"start_s":1770,"end_s":1771,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},269,"72349","¿Brasil está preparado para hacer un balance de lo que ha pasado desde 2013 hasta ahora?",1457.8,1461.86,{"idx":1773,"utterance_id":1774,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1775,"start_s":1776,"end_s":1777,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},270,"72350","¿Crees que ya hay clima para hacer un balance más sobrio?",1461.98,1466.32,{"idx":1779,"utterance_id":1780,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1781,"start_s":1782,"end_s":1783,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},271,"72351","Y, obviamente, con las consecuencias, el desenlace que eso tendría?",1467.54,1473.32,{"idx":1785,"utterance_id":1786,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1787,"start_s":1788,"end_s":1789,"word_count":60,"indexable":179},272,"72352","Porque podríamos llegar a la conclusión de que ese triplex no tenía nada que ver con Lula, y mucho menos con Petrobras.",1473.64,1482.16,{"idx":1791,"utterance_id":1792,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1793,"start_s":1794,"end_s":1795,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},273,"72353","Y que Lula probablemente habría sido elegido presidente de la República en 2018.",1482.76,1486.98,{"idx":1797,"utterance_id":1798,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1799,"start_s":1800,"end_s":1801,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},274,"72354","Estamos hablando de cosas muy serias, estamos hablando de cosas muy profundas.",1487.4,1492.28,{"idx":1803,"utterance_id":1804,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1805,"start_s":1806,"end_s":1807,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},275,"72355","Estamos hablando de un balance que puede llegar al ADN de lo que es Brasil.",1492.86,1497.66,{"idx":1809,"utterance_id":1810,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1811,"start_s":1812,"end_s":1813,"word_count":317,"indexable":179},276,"72356","¿Crees que ya estamos... Y qué falta para que estemos en una situación de poner todas las cartas sobre la mesa?",1497.7,1508.14,{"idx":1815,"utterance_id":1816,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1817,"start_s":1818,"end_s":1819,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},277,"72357","¿Y cómo va a salir eso?",1509.04,1510.68,{"idx":1821,"utterance_id":1822,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1823,"start_s":1824,"end_s":1825,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},278,"72358","Se va a dar.",1511.34,1511.82,{"idx":1827,"utterance_id":1828,"speaker_name":176,"text":1829,"start_s":1830,"end_s":1831,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},279,"72359","¿Crees que existe algún momento en que no sea importante poner todas las cartas sobre la mesa?",1512.24,1516.84,{"idx":1833,"utterance_id":1834,"speaker_name":176,"text":1835,"start_s":1836,"end_s":1837,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},280,"72360","¿Crees que existe un momento de inmadurez en que la mentira debe ser tolerada?",1516.88,1524.56,{"idx":1839,"utterance_id":1840,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1841,"start_s":1842,"end_s":1843,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},281,"72361","No, yo no.",1524.84,1525.38,{"idx":1845,"utterance_id":1846,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1847,"start_s":1848,"end_s":1849,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},282,"72362","Me estoy preocupando, me estoy poniendo en el lugar de aquel con quien te comunicas.",1525.62,1532.54,{"idx":1851,"utterance_id":1852,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1853,"start_s":1854,"end_s":1855,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},283,"72363","Estaba viendo un show de Mano Brown, reciente, en el que él dice así, está dando un show en Curitiba.",1533.46,1539.74,{"idx":1857,"utterance_id":1858,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1859,"start_s":1860,"end_s":1861,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},284,"72364","Ahí empiezan a insultar a Bolsonaro.",1540.86,1542.62,{"idx":1863,"utterance_id":1864,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1865,"start_s":1866,"end_s":1867,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},285,"72365","Entonces él dice: ¿estoy en Curitiba, nadie votó por Bolsonaro aquí?",1543.7,1546.78,{"idx":1869,"utterance_id":1870,"speaker_name":176,"text":1871,"start_s":1872,"end_s":1873,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},286,"72366","¿Nadie votó?",1548.48,1549.08,{"idx":1875,"utterance_id":1876,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1877,"start_s":1878,"end_s":1879,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},287,"72367","¿Nadie salió ahí a favor del juez que condenó a Lula?",1550.18,1554.2,{"idx":1881,"utterance_id":1882,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1883,"start_s":1884,"end_s":1885,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},288,"72368","¿Estoy loco aquí, quiero decir, estoy en Curitiba?",1554.34,1557.24,{"idx":1887,"utterance_id":1888,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1889,"start_s":1890,"end_s":1891,"word_count":60,"indexable":179},289,"72369","Creo que el mensaje que quería transmitir, siempre a su manera, era: sentémonos aquí para abrir el juego.",1558.44,1567.02,{"idx":1893,"utterance_id":1894,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1895,"start_s":1896,"end_s":1897,"word_count":9,"indexable":179},290,"72370","Entonces, obviamente que el esfuerzo que tú estás haciendo, que yo estoy haciendo, que probablemente Mano Brown está haciendo en ese ejemplo que doy,",1567.6,1573.06,{"idx":1899,"utterance_id":1900,"speaker_name":176,"text":1901,"start_s":1902,"end_s":1903,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},291,"72371","es llamar",1573.74,1574.3,{"idx":29,"utterance_id":1905,"speaker_name":176,"text":1906,"start_s":1907,"end_s":1908,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},"72372","la atención de",1574.34,1574.92,{"idx":1910,"utterance_id":1911,"speaker_name":176,"text":1912,"start_s":1913,"end_s":1914,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},293,"72373","la gente para decir, mira, este",1575,1577.74,{"idx":1916,"utterance_id":1917,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1918,"start_s":1919,"end_s":1920,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},294,"72374","proceso que empezó de manera absolutamente irracional, necesita ponerle un freno para arreglar el país.",1577.82,1584.58,{"idx":1922,"utterance_id":1923,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1924,"start_s":1925,"end_s":1926,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},295,"72375","Y ahí te pregunto sobre eso.",1585.66,1587.7,{"idx":1928,"utterance_id":1929,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1930,"start_s":1931,"end_s":1932,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},296,"72376","¿El ambiente, no lo que tú y yo pensamos, el ambiente, está evolucionando en esa dirección?",1588.12,1596.08,{"idx":1934,"utterance_id":1935,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":1936,"start_s":1937,"end_s":1938,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},297,"72377","Cuando publicas tus textos en Folha, ¿los comentarios ya están cambiando un poco?",1596.96,1602.12,{"idx":1940,"utterance_id":1941,"speaker_name":176,"text":1942,"start_s":1943,"end_s":1944,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},298,"72378","¿Siguen siendo los mismos, el mismo tira y afloja de hace dos, tres años?",1604.06,1608.74,{"idx":1946,"utterance_id":1947,"speaker_name":176,"text":1948,"start_s":1949,"end_s":1950,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},299,"72379","Creo que está mejorando.",1608.82,1610,{"idx":1952,"utterance_id":1953,"speaker_name":176,"text":1948,"start_s":1954,"end_s":1955,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},300,"72380",1610.4,1611.16,{"idx":1957,"utterance_id":1958,"speaker_name":176,"text":1959,"start_s":1960,"end_s":1961,"word_count":171,"indexable":179},301,"72381","Creo que el 30% de hidrófobos se volverá cada vez más hidrófobo, pero creo que fuera de ese 30% hay un 70% que... Está todo el mundo perdido, todos mirándose, pero creo que está mejorando.",1611.22,1626.5,{"idx":1963,"utterance_id":1964,"speaker_name":176,"text":1965,"start_s":1966,"end_s":1967,"word_count":301,"indexable":179},302,"72382","Hoy tengo mucho más acceso a personas que hace cinco años eran, digamos, mis opositores políticos, de lo que tenía entonces.",1626.6,1636.64,{"idx":34,"utterance_id":1969,"speaker_name":176,"text":1970,"start_s":1971,"end_s":1972,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},"72383","Tengo más diálogo, tengo más diálogo.",1637.2,1639.1,{"idx":1974,"utterance_id":1975,"speaker_name":176,"text":1976,"start_s":1977,"end_s":1978,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},304,"72384","Tengo más diálogo con gente.",1639.32,1640.52,{"idx":1980,"utterance_id":1981,"speaker_name":176,"text":1982,"start_s":1983,"end_s":1984,"word_count":295,"indexable":179},305,"72385","Parece bizarro pensar hoy en día que yo estaba en la PUC cuando los tipos ponían una pancarta \"FHC fascista\".",1645.6,1652.1,{"idx":1986,"utterance_id":1987,"speaker_name":176,"text":1988,"start_s":1989,"end_s":1990,"word_count":181,"indexable":179},306,"72386","¿Entendiste?",1652.9,1653.18,{"idx":1992,"utterance_id":1993,"speaker_name":176,"text":1994,"start_s":1995,"end_s":1996,"word_count":188,"indexable":179},307,"72387","FHC fascista.",1653.3,1654.32,{"idx":1998,"utterance_id":1999,"speaker_name":176,"text":2000,"start_s":2001,"end_s":2002,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},308,"72388","Fernando Henrique fascista.",1654.92,1656.12,{"idx":2004,"utterance_id":2005,"speaker_name":176,"text":2006,"start_s":2007,"end_s":2008,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},309,"72389","Se percibe la cercanía.",1658.82,1661.24,{"idx":2010,"utterance_id":2011,"speaker_name":176,"text":2012,"start_s":2013,"end_s":2014,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},310,"72390","Cuando te veía en el teatro municipal con Fernando Henrique, me daba una gran esperanza.",1662.54,1668.74,{"idx":2016,"utterance_id":2017,"speaker_name":176,"text":2018,"start_s":2019,"end_s":2020,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},311,"72391","Decía, mira, ahí están los tipos, civilizados, hablando, comunicándose.",1668.8,1673.52,{"idx":2022,"utterance_id":2023,"speaker_name":176,"text":2024,"start_s":2025,"end_s":2026,"word_count":333,"indexable":179},312,"72392","Veía ahí una posibilidad de una unión que estuve esperando también en las elecciones, que nunca ocurrió y que creo que ahora tiene que suceder.",1673.94,1683.36,{"idx":2028,"utterance_id":2029,"speaker_name":176,"text":2030,"start_s":2031,"end_s":2032,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},313,"72393","No sé si va a suceder.",1683.6,1684.54,{"idx":2034,"utterance_id":2035,"speaker_name":176,"text":2036,"start_s":2037,"end_s":2038,"word_count":213,"indexable":179},314,"72394","No sé, pero tiene que suceder.",1685.16,1686.42,{"idx":2040,"utterance_id":2041,"speaker_name":176,"text":2042,"start_s":2043,"end_s":2044,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},315,"72395","Porque si no sucede, no hay manera.",1686.46,1687.84,{"idx":2046,"utterance_id":2047,"speaker_name":176,"text":2048,"start_s":2049,"end_s":2050,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},316,"72396","Si no sucede, el país realmente se acaba.",1688.42,1690.08,{"idx":2052,"utterance_id":2053,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2054,"start_s":2055,"end_s":2056,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},317,"72397","Tú, en 2014, predijiste el escenario del 18.",1690.4,1692.52,{"idx":2058,"utterance_id":2059,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2060,"start_s":2061,"end_s":2062,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},318,"72398","¿Puedes predecir el escenario del 22?",1692.72,1695.9,{"idx":2064,"utterance_id":2065,"speaker_name":176,"text":2066,"start_s":2067,"end_s":2068,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},319,"72399","No, yo tampoco lo preví.",1696.04,1697.26,{"idx":2070,"utterance_id":2071,"speaker_name":176,"text":2072,"start_s":2073,"end_s":2074,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},320,"72400","Pero escribiste un artículo casi premonitorio.",1699.38,1702.12,{"idx":2076,"utterance_id":2077,"speaker_name":176,"text":2078,"start_s":2079,"end_s":2080,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},321,"72401","Sí, es que eso estaba pasando.",1702.24,1705.12,{"idx":2082,"utterance_id":2083,"speaker_name":176,"text":2084,"start_s":2085,"end_s":2086,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},322,"72402","No existe previsión, porque las cartas están sobre la mesa.",1707.26,1710.82,{"idx":2088,"utterance_id":2089,"speaker_name":176,"text":2090,"start_s":2091,"end_s":2092,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},323,"72403","No sabemos lo que va a pasar.",1711.16,1712.5,{"idx":2094,"utterance_id":2095,"speaker_name":176,"text":2096,"start_s":2097,"end_s":2098,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},324,"72404","Me parece que Bolsonaro, su mayor cualidad —y digo cualidad no como virtud— el rasgo más grande de él me parece la estupidez.",1713.34,1724.6,{"idx":2100,"utterance_id":2101,"speaker_name":176,"text":2102,"start_s":2103,"end_s":2104,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},325,"72405","Creo que es la estupidez por encima de todo, la estupidez por encima de todos.",1726.38,1729.88,{"idx":2106,"utterance_id":2107,"speaker_name":176,"text":2108,"start_s":2109,"end_s":2110,"word_count":317,"indexable":179},326,"72406","Tal vez eso no ayude al país, porque aunque él ganó las elecciones, no tiene estrategia; no creo que sea una estrategia.",1731.28,1743.52,{"idx":2112,"utterance_id":2113,"speaker_name":176,"text":2114,"start_s":2115,"end_s":2116,"word_count":225,"indexable":179},327,"72407","Llamar fea a la mujer del presidente francés.",1743.8,1745.64,{"idx":2118,"utterance_id":2119,"speaker_name":176,"text":2120,"start_s":2121,"end_s":2122,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},328,"72408","Porque... No tiene plan de vuelo.",1746.38,1748.82,{"idx":2124,"utterance_id":2125,"speaker_name":176,"text":2126,"start_s":2127,"end_s":2128,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},329,"72409","No tiene plan de vuelo.",1748.86,1749.6,{"idx":2130,"utterance_id":2131,"speaker_name":176,"text":2132,"start_s":2133,"end_s":2134,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},330,"72410","Tiene un plan de vuelo.",1750.2,1750.8,{"idx":2136,"utterance_id":2137,"speaker_name":176,"text":2138,"start_s":2139,"end_s":2140,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},331,"72411","Tiene el plan de vuelo de un pajarito tonto, que está chocando contra los cristales, chocando contra los cristales.",1751.48,1755.28,{"idx":2142,"utterance_id":2143,"speaker_name":176,"text":2144,"start_s":2145,"end_s":2146,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},332,"72412","En algún momento me parece que ese pajarito se va a desplomar.",1755.32,1757.72,{"idx":2148,"utterance_id":2149,"speaker_name":176,"text":2150,"start_s":2151,"end_s":2152,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},333,"72413","Ahora, cuando ese pajarito se desploma, hay que tener una buena alternativa.",1758.5,1764.34,{"idx":2154,"utterance_id":2155,"speaker_name":176,"text":2156,"start_s":2157,"end_s":2158,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},334,"72414","Y creo que ese es nuestro papel, crear una alternativa.",1764.74,1767.14,{"idx":2160,"utterance_id":2161,"speaker_name":176,"text":2162,"start_s":2163,"end_s":2164,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},335,"72415","¿Qué le ofrecemos al pueblo brasileño?",1767.66,1770.3,{"idx":2166,"utterance_id":2167,"speaker_name":176,"text":2168,"start_s":2169,"end_s":2170,"word_count":219,"indexable":179},336,"72416","¿Qué ofrecemos al país?",1772.44,1773.34,{"idx":2172,"utterance_id":2173,"speaker_name":176,"text":2174,"start_s":2175,"end_s":2176,"word_count":186,"indexable":179},337,"72417","¿Qué podemos hacer para traer a esas personas de vuelta y llevar al país a algún lugar?",1773.38,1779.2,{"idx":2178,"utterance_id":2179,"speaker_name":176,"text":2180,"start_s":2181,"end_s":2182,"word_count":301,"indexable":179},338,"72418","Y creo que hay mucha gente que tiene que unirse, que nunca se unió, tiene que unirse.",1779.68,1782.8,{"idx":2184,"utterance_id":2185,"speaker_name":176,"text":2186,"start_s":2187,"end_s":2188,"word_count":21,"indexable":179},339,"72419","Para terminar, invertimos la situación y hacemos como debería haber sido desde el principio: que yo te entreviste y no al revés.",1783.68,1789.16,{"idx":2190,"utterance_id":2191,"speaker_name":176,"text":2192,"start_s":2193,"end_s":2194,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},340,"72420","Pero Brasil está tan patas arriba que tú me entrevistaste.",1789.4,1791.92,{"idx":2196,"utterance_id":2197,"speaker_name":176,"text":2198,"start_s":2199,"end_s":2200,"word_count":356,"indexable":179},341,"72421","Quería saber de ti, ¿cómo ves Brasil en 2022 y... qué estás haciendo y crees que se puede hacer para sacarnos de ese agujero?",1792.62,1804.64,{"idx":2202,"utterance_id":2203,"speaker_name":176,"text":2204,"start_s":2205,"end_s":2206,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},342,"72422","Mira, Antônio, la política combina ciencia y arte de una manera muy particular.",1806.96,1817.62,{"idx":2208,"utterance_id":2209,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2210,"start_s":2211,"end_s":2212,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},343,"72423","Porque buscas aprender la realidad, buscas saber los datos, lo que está pasando, las oportunidades.",1818.54,1826.14,{"idx":2214,"utterance_id":2215,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2216,"start_s":2217,"end_s":2218,"word_count":272,"indexable":179},344,"72424","Pero hay una dimensión creativa de la política que creo que es la parte más fascinante.",1826.76,1831.5,{"idx":2220,"utterance_id":2221,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2222,"start_s":2223,"end_s":2224,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},345,"72425","Entonces, quien le gusta la política disfruta mucho de esa dimensión creativa y siempre piensa que hay una forma de resolver para mejorar la vida de las personas.",1832.12,1841.38,{"idx":2226,"utterance_id":2227,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2228,"start_s":2229,"end_s":2230,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},346,"72426","Así, es inherente a la actividad política aquello que se llamaba optimismo en la acción.",1841.74,1847.56,{"idx":2232,"utterance_id":2233,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2234,"start_s":2235,"end_s":2236,"word_count":333,"indexable":179},347,"72427","Puedes ser el tipo más pesimista respecto al cuadro que estás mirando, pero el optimismo en la acción está en el ADN de quien gusta de la política.",1847.9,1857.24,{"idx":2238,"utterance_id":2239,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2240,"start_s":2241,"end_s":2242,"word_count":243,"indexable":179},348,"72428","Política en el sentido más noble del término, tanto como la ciencia.",1857.34,1861.08,{"idx":2244,"utterance_id":2245,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2246,"start_s":2247,"end_s":2248,"word_count":9,"indexable":179},349,"72429","tanto como el arte, que es la dimensión creativa de la actividad humana en torno a la interacción entre las personas, que es lo que es la política.",1861.46,1869.76,{"idx":2250,"utterance_id":2251,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2252,"start_s":2253,"end_s":2254,"word_count":255,"indexable":179},350,"72430","Por eso, nunca estaré en una situación en la que no vea salida.",1870.28,1874.3,{"idx":2256,"utterance_id":2257,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2258,"start_s":2259,"end_s":2260,"word_count":4,"indexable":179},351,"72431","Creo que Brasil, creo que es un país increíble.",1876.06,1881.02,{"idx":2262,"utterance_id":2263,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2264,"start_s":2265,"end_s":2266,"word_count":193,"indexable":179},352,"72432","Y veo que hay una nueva generación en Brasil, que llegó a la universidad, que asumió protagonismo.",1881.72,1888.48,{"idx":2268,"utterance_id":2269,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2270,"start_s":2271,"end_s":2272,"word_count":230,"indexable":179},353,"72433","Creo que es esa gente la que va a hacer el nuevo diseño de Brasil.",1889.36,1894.86,{"idx":2274,"utterance_id":2275,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2276,"start_s":2277,"end_s":2278,"word_count":420,"indexable":179},354,"72434","Creo que es el negro, la mujer negra, el favelado, que hoy está en una universidad, que hoy está con... Creo que es esa gente a la que hay que escuchar, porque de ahí saldrá la energía regeneradora.",1895.4,1909.96,{"idx":2280,"utterance_id":2281,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2282,"start_s":2283,"end_s":2284,"word_count":249,"indexable":179},355,"72435","No creo en el fin de la historia, no creo en nada de eso.",1911.38,1914.96,{"idx":2286,"utterance_id":2287,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2288,"start_s":2289,"end_s":2290,"word_count":232,"indexable":179},356,"72436","Creo en fuerzas regeneradoras, porque la vida se regenera.",1915.3,1918.4,{"idx":2292,"utterance_id":2293,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2294,"start_s":2295,"end_s":2296,"word_count":49,"indexable":179},357,"72437","Y tengo mucha fe de que ese trabajo que se hizo para ampliar la oportunidad, sobre todo en la educación superior, va a generar un caldo nuevo.",1919.6,1928.66,{"idx":2298,"utterance_id":2299,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2300,"start_s":2301,"end_s":2302,"word_count":200,"indexable":179},358,"72438","Entonces, tengo mucha fe.",1929.58,1932,{"idx":2304,"utterance_id":2305,"speaker_name":176,"text":2306,"start_s":2307,"end_s":2308,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},359,"72439","Gracias, Fernando Haddad.",1933.2,1934.28,{"idx":2310,"utterance_id":2311,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2312,"start_s":2313,"end_s":2314,"word_count":195,"indexable":179},360,"72440","Gracias, Antônio Prata.",1934.68,1935.82,{"idx":2316,"utterance_id":2317,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2318,"start_s":2319,"end_s":2320,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},361,"72441","Un placer hablar contigo.",1936.4,1937.46,{"idx":2322,"utterance_id":2323,"speaker_name":104,"speaker_slug":103,"text":2324,"start_s":2325,"end_s":2326,"word_count":266,"indexable":179},362,"72442","Agradecerte que haces nuestras semanas más llevaderas con tu texto.",1938.26,1942.32,{"idx":2328,"utterance_id":2329,"speaker_name":176,"text":2330,"start_s":2331,"end_s":2332,"word_count":206,"indexable":179},363,"72443","Muchas gracias, fue un placer.",1942.74,1944.2,{"idx":2334,"utterance_id":2335,"speaker_name":176,"text":2336,"start_s":2337,"end_s":2338,"word_count":333,"indexable":179},364,"72444","Ojalá vuelva aquí en una situación más tranquila y que podamos mirar atrás y decir qué bueno que salimos de ese agujero.",1944.32,1967.32,"es",{"job_id":2341,"title":2342,"source_url":2343,"platform":2344,"content_type":2345,"published_at":2346,"duration_sec":2347,"n_classified":2348,"speakers":2349},"39881161-1e7a-4856-8531-023b1c214e6a","allTV - Painel Haddad (02\u002F09\u002F2019)  - Antônio Prata","https:\u002F\u002Fwww.youtube.com\u002Fwatch?v=DYAsSmxUyoc","youtube","video","2019-09-02T23:08:38Z",1967.322313,365,[2350],{"name":104,"slug":103,"n_falas":760},"https:\u002F\u002Fi.ytimg.com\u002Fvi\u002FDYAsSmxUyoc\u002Fhqdefault.jpg"]